Shoot.

[pancake]

After about 5 games now i've changed the shoot stat on my Gruntz units from 5 to 6 untill i get some more units i can use as better troops. Hitting gaurd 13 / 12 units with shoot 5 is hard going. When i get some minis i can use i will mix shoot 5 with shoot 6 and 7 units. Allso i have moved my assult dragamaa tank down to a heavy. untill i have other tanks in my other armys that can get by the soak and take out damage boxs. The addition of full auto is a great rule. For small vehicles and specialits with lesser powerfull weapons, for infantry killing. What shoot value do you guys use in your army. For me shoot 5 is ok for standard troops but you need other troops in with them with a better shoot .

[inrepose]

I use mostly 5 for standard units, it works when concentrating fire. But I can see how you might want to increase the chances of hitting with a 6. A five is good if you can get a unit into position and gain the +1 bonus to shoot for not moving.

[pancake]

units with shoot five are ok for standard units. but thats all i have at the moment so for now some have been changed to shoot 6 untill my new stuff gets here. A good mix is needed i think, i've been playing mostly 250 to 300 point games. you can get 3/4 squads of gruntz in that easy. so i would love to put a squad of shoot 7 power armour guys in the mix ;D

[vineksamoth]

hitting guard 12 with shoot 5 should be an average shot - 5 + 2D6 (av. 7) = 12. My standard level is shoot 4 for basic military, with (as Robin mentions) veteran and expert/elite at '5' and '6' shoot stats (can't ever see me using shoot '7'). The games i've played with these stat-lines have generally been turkey shoots for the high stat troops as they don't tend to miss. As shoot is a straight progression cost, unlike guard, it tend to overbalance the game as high Guard is easily (and more cheapily) countered.

I suppose this is down to how you want to play, but i did note most of Robin's 'cards' are shoot 5.

[pancake]

I dont want to get rid of all my shoot 5 squads they will be my standard Gruntz, i just want some troops that are shoot 6/7 just one crack squad per army with shoot 7. But at the end of the day it all adds up in points. Its finding the balance for my army, one that can handle different scenarios 90% of the gruntz units i face up against are gaurd 13. Needing fours up on each dice is hard for me i'm champion of the crap dice roll any way thanks for the reply

[inrepose]

I agree, great to have a couple of crack squads. I like a skill 6 or 7 PA squad. Deadly but more expensive to field, although a lot of fun to drop form a VTOL when some tough support is needed. I like to think of them like those large PA squads in Appleseed, dropping out into action.