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Post by timsnoddy on Feb 4, 2012 3:23:58 GMT -5
Played another great game last night which threw up a couple of questions around mini mechas classified as specilalists. AAR to follow, short version, I got hammered again.
1) As specialist mini mechas are walking specialists and not walking vehicles they move at half speed through rough terrain? Is this a correct interpretation? We took it that they were not big enough to move through the rough terrain without being slowed.
2) Can they go prone? We said yes as did not get the movement advantage for larger mechas. Are there any types of specialists which can't go prone? For example, grav bikes or fixed guns.
3) On another issue. When disembarking from a vehicle Gruntz must be placed within 3 inches of the vehicle. Is this reduced for rough terrain? We said yes and it would seem logical but it is not implicitly stated. An extra sentence under disembarkation in 1.1 would clear it up.
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Post by comstar on Feb 4, 2012 3:47:38 GMT -5
Specialists are a strange one! They can be built as normal troops ie they get there points halfed at the end and have purchased shoot and assault. Doing so they should be able to use most of the grunts abilities. This ocationally seems odd but it's like the jet biker getting off his bike and laying it down like a horse rider doing the same! As a house rule we use this to distinguish between Vehicle non Vehicle with the AP issue, -2 damage and +1 guard with a double move. Our games we only apply this to specialist that are built as vehicles (and they do get relevant movement bonuses and don't use Gruntz orders as well) these only use the skill for shooting and assault and do not purchase these (pay zero on builder) and these you do not 1/2 the points at the end! As with disembarking it is only 3" this Robin has clarified in one of the other posts here  But has said it's up to player if they want to house rule it if this doesn't seem right to you Hope that helps |
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Post by timsnoddy on Feb 4, 2012 4:12:30 GMT -5
Specialists are a strange one! They can be built as normal troops ie they get there points halfed at the end and have purchased shoot and assault. Doing so they should be able to use most of the grunts abilities. This ocationally seems odd but it's like the jet biker getting off his bike and laying it down like a horse rider doing the same! As a house rule we use this to distinguish between Vehicle non Vehicle with the AP issue, -2 damage and +1 guard with a double move. Our games we only apply this to specialist that are built as vehicles (and they do get relevant movement bonuses and don't use Gruntz orders as well) these only use the skill for shooting and assault and do not purchase these (pay zero on builder) and these you do not 1/2 the points at the end! As with disembarking it is only 3" this Robin has clarified in one of the other posts here But has said it's up to player if they want to house rule it if this doesn't seem right to you Hope that helps So if built with the mecha builder the model in question is a vehicle and if built with the specialist builder it is not? |
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Post by inrepose on Feb 4, 2012 5:55:40 GMT -5
Not strictly speaking.. This is an interesting one where I am still considering the options on the -2 damage. So far I am working on making a new builder for gruntz and vehicle based specialists which will allow the separation (thanks to Comstar for the original suggestion)
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Post by comstar on Feb 4, 2012 8:05:48 GMT -5
No worries here to help |
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Post by timsnoddy on Feb 4, 2012 15:05:14 GMT -5
Not strictly speaking.. This is an interesting one where I am still considering the options on the -2 damage. So far I am working on making a new builder for gruntz and vehicle based specialists which will allow the separation (thanks to Comstar for the original suggestion) Great news Robin. The specialist seems the hardest part of the rules to get right. Too many sub classes and it gets bogged down in minutia, perhaps just a little too broad at the moment. The proposed split seems an excellent compromise. Mini mechas are the example used in ther rules re specialists so the rules should be as tight as possible. |
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Post by gypsycomet on Feb 4, 2012 16:11:10 GMT -5
Looking at the Soak note under the Gruntz builder suggests that a Specialist built as Heavy or Assault and which has a movement mode purchased (ie. not Gruntz Walk) would be classed as a vehicle for the purposes of AP. Medium and lighter with purchased movement modes might be designated a "Rider", while Medium and lighter with no purchased movement mode are infantry.
Riders could be handled a couple different ways.
-Have Critical Boxes. Treat as vehicles for AP until an Armor or Movement Critical is taken, then becomes infantry.
-Split existing damage boxes; First set has critical spaces and is subject to AP. When first set is exhausted, model switches from vehicle to infantry and is no longer subject to AP.
"Rider" would be a designation that would probably not cost anything, as its plusses and minuses are pretty close. Models which meet the size and movement criteria which don't take the label of Rider are assumed to be using integral movement systems or rides too small to class as AP fodder (Traveller grav belts, for example, or a Segway or bicycle).
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Post by blinksquirrel on Mar 1, 2012 2:13:36 GMT -5
I played my first game tonight, I have to say it was very fun. Right off the bat I had to make the choice what my little GZG mini mecka crab walkers would be. Specialist teams or scout meckas. I made builds for them both and used them as scout meckas and it worked just fine. I got home to check the forums to see if others had the same questions. Looks like this is going to be revised in the future  I'll have to use some of the suggested rules and approches and see how they work out. Anyhow, thanks and I look forward to playing some more games of Gruntz and see how the rules evolve.  |
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Post by inrepose on Mar 1, 2012 8:51:35 GMT -5
Thanks for the note blinksquirrel. I have now broken Specialists into two types "Vehicle" and "non-vehicle" details will be in the new free rule update which Comstar has been helping with. I can't promise a date for it but the points details are now under review so it is moving on at a pace.
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But has said it's up to player if they want to house rule it 
I'll have to use some of the suggested rules and approches and see how they work out. Anyhow, thanks and I look forward to playing some more games of Gruntz and see how the rules evolve. 