Definitive Answer on Squad Attachments?

[brandu]

I was wondering what the definitive answer is for Squad Attachments as reading thru the book has me quite confused.

I just recently bought the game, but I am not new to gaming.
I have never played v1.0, only played v1.1

Squad Attachments
Page 44 and part of 46 say one thing.
Example on page 46 and page 47 says something completely different.

1: Is there a Base Cost to arm a squad with a SA beyond the cost of the weapon itself?

2: Do you add the cost of the SA before or after dividing by 2?

3: Does the SA add an extra figure to the squad or is it just a weapon that you are giving to one of the 6 members of that squad? The way it is worded on page 44 (Squad Attachments paragraph) leaves me to believe that it is a new 7th model.
There are examples of gameplay thru-out the book that show a Unit of 5 Gruntz, 1 Squad Leader AND a seventh model called SA. Pages 26, 29, 39....



ALSO:
Page 77, Squad Attachment - Medium Projectile:
The points in the book for a SA Medium Projectile is = 3 with FA
Barracks says it is = 1 or = 4 with FA
They both show the same Rng, Dam, AP

Weirdly enough, the SA Medium Laser costs the same in Barracks and the Book until you make it FA (2pts which jumps to 5 pts)


I like the game. Really, I do. I just would like to know how it's supposed to be.

-Patrick

[quozl]

How SAs worked changed majorly between 1.0 and 1.1 and part of the old details got left in the PDF unfortuately.

1: No. Just the cost of the weapon.

2: After dividing by 2. I know that's not what the little break-out box says but that's a hang-over from 1.0 of the PDF.

3: It does NOT add an extra figure. It did in 1.0, now it just replaces the weapon one guy carries.

The 1.1 method of SAs is a lot simpler and more streamlined IMO. It's in the list of things to be fixed in the errata but I don't know exactly when the errata is due.

I'm positive that www.gruntomatic.com handles squad attachments correctly. You can use it to see the points values. I looked into this issue and confirmed how it worked with Robin when implementing the SA 1.1 support in Gruntomatic.

I'd also bet money that Barracks handles them correctly but I'm currently on a Linux machine without WINE so I can't confirm that.

[brandu]

Thank you for the answers. I appreciate it.

Quick look thru Barracks (I'm using the Windows version 1.25)
comparing it to the PDF I downloaded 2 days ago.

Squad Attachments for Gruntz Squad:

Weapon
Med Projectile
Barracks = 1 Book = 3

Med Projectile FA
Barracks = 4 Book = 6

Grenade Launcher HE
Barracks = 2 Book = 1

[quozl]

Hmm,

Gruntomatic matches the book for all three of those weapons.

It's possible that Barracks has incorrect values for SA weapons. There's a forum for Barracks bug reports. Worth posting there to clarify if there's an issue.

[brandu]

Will Do.

And thank you for the link to gruntomatic.

-Patrick

[brandu]

Gruntomatic minor weirdness:
czarblood's Alien Swarm in "Forces". When you first click on the link for the Alien Swarm, it shows the cost of unit is 22. If you change the second perk to fanatics (acid blood...) the cost chages to 23 even though the cost of the perks are the same. When you change perk 2 back to Ultimate Agility it stays at 23.

When I go in and make the unit as a 'new' unit, it's 23...

-Patrick

[quozl]

Thanks Patrick.
That's because it's an old 1.0 unit. It has the 'Swarm' perk which was deleted in version 1.1 of the rules - you can see it if you print the PDF.

As the perk's gone now, the GoM can't display it anymore in the web view.

I didn't delete any old 1.0 units as I figured people might want to keep them or update them for 1.1 but it means that some of them have things like 'Swarm' that no longer exist and thus are slightly screwy through the lense of 1.1 Gruntz.

[brandu]

quozl,
While trying to make a Commander Gruntomatic wouldn't let me assign him a Specialist Weapon - Power Claw even though this is a valid weapon (bottom of page 49) in fact it's not putting up any of the specialist weapons, just the grunts and SA's.

-Patrick

[quozl]

Thanks Patrick - particularly for the pdf link, saves me searching through the rules.

I've changed it to allow Specialist weapons on Commanders. I think I missed that when updating from 1.0 rules to 1.1.

Barracks also doesn't allow specialist weapons on Commanders, probably also missed in the move from 1.0 to 1.1. There were a lot of subtle changes.

[brandu]

Quozl,
Could you move the S. Power Claw from the Commander Weapons to the CCW drop down or would you have to make a second Commander Weapons (or Commander's CCW) with it on it only?

It's the same with the Specialist page as well, right now you can't pick a ranged weapon and the power claw for close combat at the same time.

-Patrick

[quozl]

Brandu, it's classified as a specialist weapon not as a CCW weapon - page 78 of the rule book. So I don't think that you're allowed take it and a ranged weapon.

Also see page 53 for vehicle specialists - 'one weapon from the Specialists or Squad attachments table'.

I'm not sure about this though but seeing as I guess it's this way and the alternative is more edge-case weapon-box juggling, I'd need confirmation before I change it If you can get confirmation then I'll try and implement it.

[timvidlak]

The Commander & Specialist have The Power Claw under Close Combat Weapons in the Barracks but it doesn't become available until you have chosen Soak 14. Also it is available for Power Armor Gruntz Squads as a CCW.

[brandu]

Quozl,
Okay, fair enough. Just thought it was a mistake cause it's the only CCW in that whole list and it seemed rather strange that I can have an Assault Class Commander in Power Armor that can't take a ranged weapon...

Robin! Help!!!!

-Patrick

[brandu]

timvidlak,
Huh, okay, that lends itself to my opinion. Now we just need the "da Boss" to decide which way it goes...

-Patrick

I just tried it on my Barracks: v1.25 running in Windows
Power Claw shows up under CCW for Commander and Specialist even if I pick Guard and Soak at 10 and Damage at 12.

[quozl]

Boo! You've convinced me :-p

I'll make it a CCW available only to specialists and commanders. I'll have to figure out exactly what it should do on Power armour squads - ie pay once as a CCW or pay per squad member.

be a day or two.